GIGnews: Interview with Jeff Anderson of Turbine

June 2003

A CHAT WITH JEFF ANDERSON

GIGnews recruited Melanie Cambron, known by most in the industry as The Game Recruiting Goddess, to use her skills for the good of gamekind and recruit some of the big names in the industry to give us all valuable insight into what they do and how they do it.

In this interview, Melanie chats up Jeff Anderson, President and CEO of Turbine Entertainment, developers of the Asheron’s Call online games, as well as the upcoming Middle Earth Online, based on J.R.R. Tolkien's novel The Lord of the Rings, and the very recently announced Dungeons & Dragons Online.

Prior to joining Turbine in March 2001, Jeff was the Executive in Charge of Production for Origin Systems Inc. (a subsidiary of Electronic Arts). At Origin, he managed the Ultima Online franchise where he was directly responsible for expanding their online gaming business. In particular, he produced EA's first-ever MMP expansion pack and focused on building the next generation of 3-D online worlds. Prior to that, Jeff was Executive Director for the consumer products division of Viacom, Inc. In that role, he directly managed Paramount Pictures' world-wide interactive licensing, merchandising and business development. Before Viacom, he was the Vice President of Operations at Mission Studios Corporation, a game developer in Illinois. Mr. Anderson also practiced law at the firm of Holleb & Coff in Chicago, where he concentrated on both intellectual property and corporate litigation. He graduated summa cum laude from the University of Illinois, and served on the Law Review at the University of Chicago Law School.

MC: In another interview you said that online gaming was your true love and that "no other entertainment medium can bring people together, entertain them, and forge real-world relationships." As an accomplished developer of some enormous MMORPGs, what do you consider to be the greatest challenges specific to creating an online game?

JA: There are a lot of challenges, such as technology, product development, services, funding, human resources…However, the greatest challenges are not that different from those that face developers of single-player games. A successful game requires a great team with a strong, central vision; excellent communication underpinned by a well-conceived plan; and supportive partners. It’s true that online games complicate the matter because of their larger team size, longer development cycle and interesting design complications. Nevertheless, the greatest challenges are about magnitude more than uniqueness.

MC: In a GIGnews article last month, the popularity of online games was discussed and while a number of companies have jumped on the subscription model bandwagon, it was noted that while some online games seem to be adding subscribers like crazy, others seem barely able to maintain their small subscriber base, or are even in decline. What, in your estimation, makes some games succeed while others flounder?

JA: Subscribers appreciate quality experiences. They are looking for the right balance between short-term fun and long-term commitment. They enjoy a wide variety of gameplay – from combat to crafting, adventuring to socialization. The more successful online games are able to deliver a high quality experience across each axis while maintaining their connective tissue. An online game needs to be more than just its constituent parts. There has to be a larger purpose and meaning to the features. In some ways, I suppose, it is kind of like the covalent bonds that arise from the sharing of electrons between atoms…Or maybe not. <smile>

MC: Do you think it’s possible for small, self-published developers, without the marketing budget of the big boys, to actually be able to make it in online games?

JA: The answer is both "Yes" and "No." It is awfully difficult these days to compete on the MMP front. The funding necessary to make a market-relevant online world is pretty large – probably in the eight figures. That makes it very hard for small developers to enter the MMP category. However, I think there is hope. I would encourage them to stay away from the big world games and focus instead on a different online experience. For example, I like the work that Daniel James is doing on Puzzle Pirates. In my mind, the challenge is whether these lighter online games can build and sustain a profitable subscription base. Only time will tell, but I wish them a lot of luck.

MC: Having worked on such games as Ultima Online and Asheron’s Call, what specific differences do you see in developing original games versus a licensed-based game like Middle Earth Online. And, how involved has the Tolkien estate been in the development of the game?

JA: Obviously, a licensed franchise requires the coordination and approval of many different entities. With a strong license, you can focus on the key issues faster since a lot of the minutia has been settled (e.g., the game is going to take place in this setting with these monsters).

However, the strength can also become a challenge, which we confronted with Tolkien with Middle-Earth Online. A good example is how we wanted to treat player character death in Middle-Earth. Tolkien’s world doesn’t really allow for the resurrection of fallen heroes (yes, I know that there are a few exceptions, but they are exceptions!), so we needed a way to handle that fictionally in the game world. That is where the partnerships really come into play. I can’t say enough good things about the guys at Universal and Tolkien Enterprises. They are just terrific to work with and have really helped make this a much better game. I couldn’t imagine trying to do this without them!

MC: I googled "Middle Earth Online" and there is already so much buzz about the game not only on the typical gaming sites, but on the Tolkien fan sites as well, that it could almost start to feel overwhelming I would think. Jeff, this really seems to be such a coup. How did Turbine go about landing this license?

JA: I think that Middle-Earth Online is one of the most important online projects in development today. (I am a little biased of course). The franchise has a massive demographic and worldwide appeal. Tolkien truly is the "father of all fantasy" – there is nothing bigger. It is quite an honor. As for as how we got the license, I think it came down to our commitment to the franchise and desire to make great online games.

MC: I’m sure every Tolkien fan considers himself or herself something of an expert on all things Middle Earth. How many "suggestions" have you already received about the development of the game? And do you think it will be possible to make everyone happy?

JA: We get hundreds of suggestions every day at http://forums.middle-earthonline.com/. (This is the official developer’s forum for the MEO project.) There are already more than ten thousand registered users, and we have barely been up a week. The feedback has been tremendous as well. A lot of great ideas are coming out of the boards. I was reading the conversation about how long it should take a player to walk from the Shire to Bree – some people think it should take five minutes while others would prefer for it to take closer to 48 hours of continuous walking. So, I guess the answer is "no." I don’t think it is possible to make everyone happy! Still, I hope that everyone will appreciate the fact that we will explain our ideas, engage in some discussion and then make the best possible game for everyone.

MC: As for your other recent coup, while wasting away one Sunday afternoon I saw a program on VH1 about the 1980s. One of the more hilarious segments in the program was on Dungeons & Dragons. People have such intense D&D nostalgia whether they actually played or just marveled at those who did. With so much pop culture history tied up in the game, how will Turbine approach its development? Will the game appeal to more than just the traditional D&D player?

JA: Where Tolkien is the father of fantasy, I’d say that D&D is the father of role-playing. Our job with that project is to stay true to its roots and deliver an excellent online role-playing game. The challenge is to balance the project with the audience. We have a lot of hardcore D&D gamers here at Turbine who are totally into the rules, history and nostalgia. (And rightly so!) Still, we don’t want to discourage a new generation of D&D players from enjoying the title.

MC: On a more personal note, I’ll admit that when I first met you several years ago, I was intimidated by a certain indefinable personality trait that you seemed to possess. Your assistant at Origin also felt the same way but we couldn’t seem to pinpoint what exactly it was. As our friendship has grown over the years, I’ve come to know you as a wonderful manager of people with a delightful sense of humor and keen sense for motivation. Remarkably intelligent people like yourself don’t always have the ability to relate to others. And, certainly, not every former lawyer could successfully manage such a creative and diverse group of people as game developers. How do you do it?

JA: (Of course, you *had* to bring up the lawyer thing. It was a mistake I made in my youth. As you know, I’m in a 12-step program to help me recover.) As for the other stuff, I just try to be a good person and admit when I screw up. I have made more than my share of mistakes over the years and done some pretty stupid things from time to time. I look back at a couple of decisions and I really regret them, but I try to apologize for them and move on. I guess that helps.

MC: If you could narrow your success down to three key elements, what would they be?

JA: Actually, I don’t see myself as successful. Ask me that question again after Turbine buys EA!

AUTHOR BIO
Melanie Cambron is a recruiter for game industry leaders such as THQ, Rockstar, and Sony. Featured in Game Design: Secrets of the Sages and Secrets of the Game Business for her game industry knowledge, she also wrote the foreword to the successful book, Game Programming with Direct X 7.0 and its follow-up. Melanie speaks each semester at the University of Texas at Austin and the University of North Texas on the game development industry, and is frequently interviewed by major media such as the Dallas Morning News for her industry expertise. She also serves as a consultant to the City of Austin's Interactive Industry Development Committee. Learn more about the "Game Recruiting Goddess" at www.melaniecambron.com or contact her directly at melanie@melaniecambron.com

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